Sunday, February 24, 2008

Christians for Allah

I am founding a new organization, Christians for Allah. Our goal is to make the prophethood of Muhammad a unavoidable issue for Christians.

We Qur'anic Christians believe in the Newer Testament (Qur'an) to be the innerant word of Allah. We recognize the value of traditional Christian literature, but only where it is supported by or conformable to the Word of Allah. We regard it as in no way binding upon life or faith.

We believe that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad, peace be upon him, is His final prophet, though there were many before him such as Ibrahim, Yukub, Musa or Jesus. Jesus was a great prophet although Allah begets none and is not begotten. His death upon the cross was only an illusion, Judas dying in his place.

We Qur'anic Christians are dedicated to sharing the Word of Allah to our Christian brethren, who missed the good word when the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, preached Allah's word.

We follow the Newer Testament (Qur'an), worship in a Qur'anic church, and believe that Muhammad provided for us the path to salvation, in accordance with the Old, New and Newer Covenant.

One can be Muslim and Christian at the same time. Allahu Ackbar!


Sounds ridiculous, eh? Read this, and tell me if you see Jewish or Christian writing.


Anonymous said...

That's a good one! I'd like to see an organization like this really come to fruition. It would make the Christians realize what we have to deal with.

Anonymous said...

but it should be "Christians for Muhammad" not Christians for Allah.

WomanHonorThyself said...

wowza Bar..good lookin out!..come see my will make u cringe bro..sorry!

Rita Loca said...

Well, I see both...

Avi said...

JM, when was your last visit to shul? I'm there every week and I've never heard the rabbi speak like that. Unless of course you know Judaism better than the rabbi... (You certainly know Christianity better than him.)

Rita Loca said...

I have only been once. I do not know much about Judaism which is why I enjoy reading your blog. From my limited understanding, I answered your question.

I did not feel very welcome but my husband had need of an interview of the rabbi for his thesis.
BTW, we chose to go on Purim and it was very loooooong! but everyone seemed to be enjoying themselves.

Avi said...

Hmmm... Purim was long? That's interesting. I love Purim! (Its coming up in a few weeks). Well I guess one needs to know what's going on.

Keep coming back!

Avi said...
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Anonymous said...

Why not? We all worship the same moon.

Anonymous said...

We believe in one sovereign God, existing in three persons: my God, your God, and G_d.

Rita Loca said...

Yes, I am sure understanding would help. The Rabbi was very friendly and had invited us. There was a big party afterwards.
But, back to the article you linked to, it may sound very Christian to you, coming from your Jewish background, but it is very different from how we present it in most Christian churches. I was looking at it from my Christian perspective.

Anonymous said...

najistani: are you Maryam from Renegade Eye's blog? If so, are you an atheist now?

Harry said...

You want something even worse? Check out -

Let me know if it turns your stomach as it did mine.

Papa Frank said...

After looking at that sight that Harry left here it is clear that christianity is way behind on the coming up with a cool and distinctive type of beard. I'm going to work on that with my christian brothers and see what we could come up with. :)

Deborah said...

Good grief!

Though not a follower of Yeshua, I say, "hear, hear," to the words of a reasonable man... to Gamaliel, a Pharisee, respected teacher of Torah, and member of the Sanhedrin, who said, "Men of Israel, take heed to yourselves what you intend to do regarding these men. For some time ago Theudas rose up, claiming to be somebody. A number of men, about four hundred, joined him. He was slain, and all who obeyed him were scattered and came to nothing. After this man, Judas of Galilee rose up in the days of the census, and drew away many people after him. He also perished, and all who obeyed him were dispersed. And now I say to you, keep away from these men and let them alone; for if this plan or this work is of men, it will come to nothing; but if it is of God, you cannot overthrow it—lest you even be found to fight against God." (Acts 5:35-39)

Anonymous said...

Hoooooooold on. Deborah: ain't ya Christian?

Deborah said...

Yes, Eitan, I'm a follower of Yeshua. My bad writing skills got in the way - I meant to attribute "though not a follower of Yeshua" to Gamaliel. Good grief... I'm soooooo confused, now... thought we all agreed to lay down the Christian vs. Jewish debate on BK's blog when he instigated the agreement (although, I did forget and got caught up in it yesterday morning - sorry).

At any rate, to answer your question about being Jewish and Christian at the same time, BK, Jews and 95% of Christians view and understand the doctrines and person of Yeshua as a Greco-Roman creation that is far removed from Judaism. For the most part, Christianity as you and most others know and understand it IS a Greco-Roman religion as it stands today, when it is actually a continuation of Judaism at the root - its core teachings echo Torah loud and clear! Sure, it may be a heretical teaching of Judaism as you understand it, but originally it was very Jewish. The early church fathers of the Catholic persuasion (namely St. Augustine) during the 3rd and 4th centuries CE, out of their anti-Semitic hatred, intentionally stripped Hebrew and Judaism from the doctrine of the early believers who followed Yeshua. I am amazed nearly every day as another layer of that Greco-Roman doctrine is pealed away from my understanding, revealing a very Jewish Yeshua.

The book of Matthew was originally written in Hebrew and is filled with Hebrew idioms, but only one Hebrew copy remains today - one that has been paid little attention to. Matthew's Greek translation, full of Hebraisms, and which is definitely most used by Christian scholars, losses the original intent of those Hebrew idioms. Many Christian scholars rely on the Pentateuch as well; here again, losing the emphasis of the Hebrew langauge and idioms.

Regardless of the translations, Yeshua taught the same principles found in the written and oral Torah (Matthew 5, 6, & 7... just to demonstrate a few core principles). Yeshua taught how to pray to G-d, helping those in need, humility, repentance, and fasting, which paved the way for manifestation of the divine reign. These actions led the disciple into a right relationship with G-d through faithful obedience. More and more true followers of Yeshua are learning the truth - learning that their "Christianity" has been propped up with Hellenized-Romanized thought and pagan tradition. Though this comprises only a small percentage of Christians, it is a phenomena that's gaining momentum. It's yet another indication that it is the beginning of the end of days in which G-d will restore all things to His original intent - restoring even the Hebrew language on a worldwide scale. More and more followers of Yeshua are desiring to learn Hebrew, too... part of that phenomena. Hence, my earlier reference to Gamaliel's observation and resolve. Personally, upon receiving all the resources, I will begin to scribe Torah in the Hebrew, with transliteration and English translation below, whether the task takes several years or not.


Anonymous said...

deborah: than are you a missionary? You are openly blobbering about Christianity on a Jewish Zionist site and you have a Jewish name.

Avi said...

Just FYI: I don't mind at all that Christians talk about Christianity. Please, feel free to speak about your faith. Just let me have free range to respond Jewishly. No topic is off-limits. Just no more playing the "offended" game.

Papa Frank said...

BK -- come on by my place. I have perfected the new Christian beard!!!

Deborah said...

No, I'm not a missionary nor an evangelist.

Long before it was popular, my mother was raising her children to love and respect the Jewish people - she taught us the Jews are G-d's chosen people, the apple of His eye. She taught us about the Holocaust and that it must never happen again. She taught her children that if something like the Holocaust ever happens again, we are to protect Jewish life at the sacrifice of our own comfort, safety, and life if necessary. I've always been painfully aware of Christianity's history - it's crimes against the Jewish people. Because of the association between words and actions, it's not my preference to use the words"Christ", "Christian(ity)", and "church", but "Messiah/Mashiach/Yeshua", "follower/disciple of Yeshua", and "congregation".

I'm a lover of the Jewish people, whether big, small, religious, non-religious, white, black, Russian or Brazilian. I'm a Zionist who believes EVERY Jew deserves to make Aliyah!!!!!!! I love and support Eretz Israel! I pray for the peace of Jerusalem! In the past year, I seriously started studying the Hebraic roots of my faith.

My prayer, my hope, is that anti-Semitism will be eradicated from Christian doctrine - I pray Greco-Roman thought and its paganism will be eradicated from Christian doctrine - but this will only happen via education - Christians need to be educated regarding the Hebraic roots of their faith and the atrocious, self-serving history of the church - you'd be amazed how ignorant most Christians are about the sins of the church fathers and its leaders! Further, my prayer is that there will be new understanding, respect, and healing between Jews and Christians - even while they maintain different beliefs about Mashiach.

By the way, it has become apparent to me that Jews equate Christianity with Catholicism. I am not Catholic nor am I an Eastern or Greek Orthodox Christian. I am not Lutheran, Presbyterian, Episcopalian, Mennonite, Puritan, Methodist, or Baptist... to name only a few. I am a non-denominational/non-sectarian disciple of Yeshua... I cling to the written words of the entire Tanakh and the Brit Chadashah, not to the dogma of men. Catholics, Presbyterians, Episcopalians, Lutherans, and other denominations believe the "church" replaced the Jews in G-d's heart, I don't. The same believe a baby, unable to decide for itself, can be baptized into Christianity, I don't. Baptists believe once "saved" always saved, I don't. Catholics, Presbyterians, Episcopalians, and some Methodist believe the second coming of Messiah and His kingdom reign are "spiritual" not real, I don't. Mormons, who are not Christians but heretics, believe the New Jerusalem will be in Missouri, USA. (Good grief - how's that for a doctrine that replaces the house of Jacob and Eretz Israel?!)

Although I may be in the minority, I'm not a Lone Ranger by any means! There are thousands of us who are beginning to learn and understand the Hebraic roots of our faith, who love the Jewish people, Israel, and Jerusalem!

Shalom, Eitan! You are dear to me by virtue of your birthright via an everlasting covenant with the ONE and TRUE G-d, blessed be HaShem!

P.S. You can accuse me of blubbering, that doesn't offend me in the least. But don't compare me to a Catholic or I may stomp on your toes! :p

Devorah Chayah said...

Bar Kochba, I was just gonna say it makes as much sense as J4J's. Funny! Very cute.

Deborah wrote: "I'm a Zionist who believes EVERY Jew deserves to make Aliyah!!!!!!! ... I seriously started studying the Hebraic roots of my faith."

I refer one and all to

Tsofah said...

This is deeply disturbing, BK. Unfortunately, there are those who DO believe in both.

You know, I cannot undo all the years of persecution and hatred of other Christians and churches. However, I wish I could. I truly wish I could.

If we do not stand together now, we may see both Jews and Christians being jailed and killed together. It scares me to think a Christian would once again be duped into thinking there is no difference between the G-d of Abraham, Isaac, and Israel...and the demonic pagan moon god, allah.

The Megillat of Esther is especially appropriate right now. Not every Persian was against the Jews.

Just Haman and his followers.

May G-d bless you..

Avi said...

Tsofah: This post had nothing to do with politics. Let's clarify the term Judeo-Christian. In matters of values, Jews and Christians share a great deal. We must stand together against the forces of radical Islam and secular hedonism. But when it comes to beliefs, there is no Judeo-Christian values. Jews share no beliefs with Christians. We have G-d's Torah and Christians follow a twisted pagan man-god.

Devorah Chayah said...

PS: I'd just like to add for Deborah's sake that we've already been there and done the late middle ages.

"...Jews and 95% of Christians view and understand the doctrines and person of Yeshua as a Greco-Roman creation that is far removed from Judaism."

So thought Martin Luther. No wonder the Jews didn't recognize Yeshu dressed in the robes of Catholicism. Surely they would be more amenable to the Reformed, Lutheran version. After twenty years of turn downs he decided Jews were fit only to be herded into synagogues and burned. So he wrote, and so did those who read his writings, including Hitler, y"sh.

Xians in their pitiable ignorance do not know or understand that we have our own sources from the time period. In actual point of fact, we know a lot more about him than they do, passed down from those who knew him personally.

I find it laughable that Yeshu handpicked twelve men to carry on his work and message and yet at least half of the NT is written by a man who never even met him in person. (the Damascus Road "meeting" aside.)

Anonymous said...


Not to worry. I won't do any of it. Whatever G-d wants you to know, He will tell you. But I will say that, as a Christian, I am NOT, I repeat NOT for Allah or Mohummad, though I have heard about such a thing. Those 'christians' aren't really. If they knew their New Testsment, then they'd know the two are as far removed as the East is from the west.

Allah was a moon god or some sort, and who hates Christians as much as he hates Jews and anyone who doesn't conform to Islam, voluntarily or by force.

If I had to guess, this is from an....ecumenical group, that is a religious tossed salad to the point where, excepting anything and everything, there is no real definition of what they believe anymore. You are far more to be envied,(taking a stand for ONE belief) than those who try to stand in ten different directions at one time and end up not knowing where they stand.


Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...

Hi Deborah,

Excellent....I was just listening to Acts on cd. Though, whenever you're listening to the Bible (old or new) I find, at least for myself, that I have to read and listen, or, in the middle of doing what I'm doing, while listening, I get distracted and don't retain as much of what I wanted to.

To the owner of the site; when I first read that the site was 'anti-messianic,' I thought I'd be the only Christian gentile on this page. Thankfully, you've been quite welcoming. Thank you. And I will return your respect by being respectful of your rules. I just hope you don't have a rule about bad spelling. Ha, ha. I just realized it's five in the morning and I've been on the internet, checking out things that validate the Inerrancy of the Bible. King David, The Denarius, (Roman coin) and other points.

Like Deborah, (and you can take this for what it's worth) I am a friend of the people of THE BOOK. Jews gave the world the Bible. I can't undo the sins of the past but I do hope that (agreeing to disagree) we can at least be mutually respectful and friendly. I'm willing if you are.

I'm gonna shut up and go to bed now.

Clover said...

Shalom! I'm christian who's very interested in Judaism-hence i'm at this blog and christians for allah is islam. If you believe in christianity you cannot believe that mohammed is a prophet cos we believe all the prophets came from the line of Issac and David and not ishmael. Anyway, i love y'all :)

Anonymous said...

Hi Clover and AMEN! The G-OD of the Bible is NOT the Allah of Islam! Old Testament. New Testaments. Both testaments. The BIBLE has NOTHING to do with the Allah of Islam. And to know that, all you have to do is read the Qur'an.

For those who are 'Christian' and reading this, there is a verse in the Qur'an that says "Say NOT that Allah had a son." Sura 23:91 In the New Testament, the contrasting verse is John 3:16. Well, it's either one or the other. If God is ALLAH, then the god of the Bible is lying and therefore, not G-D. If the god of the BIBLE is G-D, then ALLAH is lying. It can't be both.